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Author Topic: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread  (Read 26368 times)

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Offline skcusICH

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #30 on: October 25, 2014, 06:11:21 AM »
The sense of optimism is curious to see. The Saints have won both their games at home, and rival Seattle in having a home field advantage. Their four losses have been by a total of less than ten points. This game has all the signs of being a case of whoever has the ball last. Because although the defense has been improving, the Saints are one of the few teams in the league that can be as explosive as the Packers on offense. Expect a really good game, and expect a lot of points, and expect one mistake in the waning minutes of the fourth quarter to decide the outcome.
Their 4 losses are by a combined 27 points. They got blown out by Dallas before making it respectable in garbage time. The other 3 losses were very close games though. I believe they've held the lead 5 times this season in the last 4 minutes of the game. I agree that it's going to be a tough game.

I've seen a mention of the lack of sacks the Saints have allowed. Looks good on paper...but not so good on tape. Drew Brees is refusing to take sacks and chucking the ball up. I can't believe this guy gets away with as much intentional grounding as he does. Some of them are very smart throws at the feet of a RB, but others are blatant intentional grounding in my opinion. He's thrown quite a few interceptions while under pressure and has had many passes just flutter no where from being hit and desperately trying to get the ball out. Either he's really good at doing this, or just plain lucky...I'm guessing a little of both. It's no secret that Drew Brees is short, so I think it's vital that the inside rushers get some push up the middle. It seems Brees is really struggling when he gets his line pushed back into the pocket. He doesn't like leaving the pocket very much and I think it's vital that if the rushers can't get there, that they get their arms up to bat some passes down. Brees has had quite a few batted at the line this season. One of these balls can easily end in an interception.

His number one escape valve has obviously been Pierre Thomas. Can Mark Ingram be that guy and also pass protect? I don't know that answer. If he can't and Cadet needs to be that guy, they may become predictable or not be able to offer much in the running game. Play pass all the way with Cadet in the lineup. He's not going to beat you on the ground by himself.

I'm wondering what the safety combination is going to be on base and nickel if Burnett is a scratch. I'm guessing it will be Hyde and Clinton-Dix. Richardson and Clinton-Dix in the dime with Hyde playing his usual kind of safety/LB/4th CB role in that defense.

I don't like Micah Hyde's ability to come up and tackle on a swing, screen, or run play. He usually gets himself in position to make the play, but doesn't seem to have the ability to drive a ball carrier to the ground without being carried for a few extra yards like Clinton-Dix and Sean Richardson have shown they're able to do. But then again, if Jimmy Graham is healthy and running all his normal routes, I'm not sure Sean Richardson would be able to run with him in that situation if forced to. Tough match ups against New Orleans, that's for sure.

Offline skcusICH

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #31 on: October 25, 2014, 06:31:53 AM »
I'd feel much better about the secondary match ups with a healthy Sam Shields. Excellent at covering the deep ball and could shadow speedy Kenny Stills. Davon House has played shutdown football this year and might have the size to compete with the bigger Marques Cotston. Tramon Williams can still run and is playing as well as he ever has. I think he'd hold his own against the little and shifty Brandin Cooks. Luckily, if Shields can't go, Casey Hayward is a damn good option as a 4th corner.

Offline B

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #32 on: October 25, 2014, 06:32:33 AM »
...if Jimmy Graham is healthy and running all his normal routes, I'm not sure Sean Richardson would be able to run with him in that situation if forced to...

A healthy Jimmy Graham is a tough matchup for any one in the NFL as an elite pass catching TE. However, it always surprises me that people forget how fast Sean Richardson is -- he ran a 4.40 at the combine with an average time of 4.43 in the 40. I was excited as Hell when the Packers signed him coming out of Vanderbilt

What has held Sean back has been two things, a serious neck injury and the fact that he was used more as a hybrid safety/linebacker at Vandy. Sean used his speed to get back in coverage after starting down in the box on most plays, so he has had to learn how to play back in coverage at a Pro level.

Richardson has an unbelieveable size/speed ratio for a safety and really lit things up in training camp this year. The Packers are so much better and deeper at safety this year than at any time since Collins went down to his tragic career ending neck injury.

Honestly, with his size and speed, Richardson might be an ideal matchup with a banged up Graham - if I were NO I would be aware of the World of hurting Sean might put on my hobbled super star tightend if Brees put up on of his passes that at times leaves his recievers vulnerable to big hits.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2014, 06:38:03 AM by B »
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Offline skcusICH

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #33 on: October 25, 2014, 07:24:44 AM »
...if Jimmy Graham is healthy and running all his normal routes, I'm not sure Sean Richardson would be able to run with him in that situation if forced to...

A healthy Jimmy Graham is a tough matchup for any one in the NFL as an elite pass catching TE. However, it always surprises me that people forget how fast Sean Richardson is -- he ran a 4.40 at the combine with an average time of 4.43 in the 40. I was excited as Hell when the Packers signed him coming out of Vanderbilt

What has held Sean back has been two things, a serious neck injury and the fact that he was used more as a hybrid safety/linebacker at Vandy. Sean used his speed to get back in coverage after starting down in the box on most plays, so he has had to learn how to play back in coverage at a Pro level.

Richardson has an unbelieveable size/speed ratio for a safety and really lit things up in training camp this year. The Packers are so much better and deeper at safety this year than at any time since Collins went down to his tragic career ending neck injury.

Honestly, with his size and speed, Richardson might be an ideal matchup with a banged up Graham - if I were NO I would be aware of the World of hurting Sean might put on my hobbled super star tightend if Brees put up on of his passes that at times leaves his recievers vulnerable to big hits.

You make an excellent point about Richardson laying a hit on a not fully healed Jimmy Graham. I don't recall any safeties in Green Bay that could hit like he does. The first that comes to mind is Chuck Cecil. I was not aware that Sean Richardson had that impressive of a 40 time. To me he looks kind of slow moving in space on the field and I remember 1 play in specific in the preseason where it made me think that he isn't that prototype player who I thought he was. Maybe I'll have to take a closer look. There is no questioning his enforcer ability and his in the box play.

From day 1 of the season, I wanted to see Clinton-Dix at free safety and Sean Richardson at strong safety. To me, they have the perfect skill sets to play those positions. I absolutely love the combination of safeties the Packers have this year. Each one brings something unique to the table and it's amazing how the weak unit on the defense one year ago now is strength of the team. Excellent front office decisions, coaching, and off season work.

Online ricky

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #34 on: October 25, 2014, 08:21:34 AM »
The sense of optimism is curious to see. The Saints have won both their games at home, and rival Seattle in having a home field advantage. Their four losses have been by a total of less than ten points. This game has all the signs of being a case of whoever has the ball last. Because although the defense has been improving, the Saints are one of the few teams in the league that can be as explosive as the Packers on offense. Expect a really good game, and expect a lot of points, and expect one mistake in the waning minutes of the fourth quarter to decide the outcome.
Their 4 losses are by a combined 27 points. They got blown out by Dallas before making it respectable in garbage time. The other 3 losses were very close games though. I believe they've held the lead 5 times this season in the last 4 minutes of the game. I agree that it's going to be a tough game.

Thanks for the correction. You're absolutely right. I feel  :-[ for not double checking before posting.
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Online claymaker

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #35 on: October 25, 2014, 11:07:41 AM »
You make an excellent point about Richardson laying a hit on a not fully healed Jimmy Graham. I don't recall any safeties in Green Bay that could hit like he does. The first that comes to mind is Chuck Cecil. I was not aware that Sean Richardson had that impressive of a 40 time. To me he looks kind of slow moving in space on the field and I remember 1 play in specific in the preseason where it made me think that he isn't that prototype player who I thought he was. Maybe I'll have to take a closer look. There is no questioning his enforcer ability and his in the box play.

From day 1 of the season, I wanted to see Clinton-Dix at free safety and Sean Richardson at strong safety. To me, they have the perfect skill sets to play those positions. I absolutely love the combination of safeties the Packers have this year. Each one brings something unique to the table and it's amazing how the weak unit on the defense one year ago now is strength of the team. Excellent front office decisions, coaching, and off season work.

Richardson isn't the type that can stop on a dime and change direction. His size is prototypical but his attributes aren't, he's no Sean Taylor. He has the size and speed, but a lot of what Safeties do in the NFL revolves around angles and being in the right spot. He had a ton of trouble in coverage at Vanderbilt, and was strictly an "in-the-box" Safety. I would not look to him to match up against Jimmy Graham.

Fortunately, he has been given time to develop and is looking like an NFL Safety. His special teams play means he'll be around for as long as they can keep him, but he could turn into a starter down the road. He offers elite athleticism at Safety, and once he buckles down he could be a really good one. He'll need to make another jump next year if he wants to challenge a starting spot.

We've seen a ton of good Safety play this year. Clinton-Dix looks tapped as far as athleticism is concerned, but boy can he play. He won't be an All-Pro, I don't think, but Pro Bowl caliber for sure. Richardson has seen his share of snaps on defense as well. When he's been in there he's been flying to the ball and, I assume, communicating well or he wouldn't be in there.

Offline Hincha

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #36 on: October 25, 2014, 11:51:44 AM »
I'd feel much better about the secondary match ups with a healthy Sam Shields. Excellent at covering the deep ball and could shadow speedy Kenny Stills.

For the Packers fans that lived through the 80s.... Kenny Stills father is the Ken Stills who one time laid out Matt Suhey (after the whistle).

Offline marklawrence

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #37 on: October 26, 2014, 12:33:49 AM »
Las Vegas, Bing and Nate Silver all have us losing this game. The Saints have won 13 straight at home under Payton. If we win it will be an upset. It's certainly hard to predict we'll win in a blowout. Furthermore, neither of these teams is out of it until the clock dies - either one has the capacity to score 21 points in the 4th quarter. Several here have said it's likely to come down to who has the ball last, and I agree with that. And Payton will not stupidly leave an extra minute on the clock for us like Miami did.

That said, if I read any garbage here about how we're losing and that means our season is over and everyone should be fired, there's gonna be deleted posts and instant time outs.

I'm frequently accused of not allowing negative comments. That's completely untrue. What I don't allow are these "the sky is falling, we're all gonna die, we'll never win another superbowl, people need to be fired" comments. You wanna talk that way, start a thread in the rant section and say whatever you want. You say it in this thread, it's the last thing you'll say in this thread for a while.

It has not escaped the attention of Larry and I that many of the worst offenders on game day don't even post here the rest of the week  - they just come here on game day to make sure as many people as possible feel as bad as they do. We're deeply tired of this.
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Offline Twain

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #38 on: October 26, 2014, 08:27:26 AM »
Sounds like Nate Silver doesn't have enough polling data this time. ;)
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Offline Beagle

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #39 on: October 26, 2014, 09:15:37 AM »
...if Jimmy Graham is healthy and running all his normal routes, I'm not sure Sean Richardson would be able to run with him in that situation if forced to...

A healthy Jimmy Graham is a tough matchup for any one in the NFL as an elite pass catching TE. However, it always surprises me that people forget how fast Sean Richardson is -- he ran a 4.40 at the combine with an average time of 4.43 in the 40. I was excited as Hell when the Packers signed him coming out of Vanderbilt

What has held Sean back has been two things, a serious neck injury and the fact that he was used more as a hybrid safety/linebacker at Vandy. Sean used his speed to get back in coverage after starting down in the box on most plays, so he has had to learn how to play back in coverage at a Pro level.

Richardson has an unbelieveable size/speed ratio for a safety and really lit things up in training camp this year. The Packers are so much better and deeper at safety this year than at any time since Collins went down to his tragic career ending neck injury.

Honestly, with his size and speed, Richardson might be an ideal matchup with a banged up Graham - if I were NO I would be aware of the World of hurting Sean might put on my hobbled super star tightend if Brees put up on of his passes that at times leaves his recievers vulnerable to big hits.

You make an excellent point about Richardson laying a hit on a not fully healed Jimmy Graham. I don't recall any safeties in Green Bay that could hit like he does. The first that comes to mind is Chuck Cecil. I was not aware that Sean Richardson had that impressive of a 40 time. To me he looks kind of slow moving in space on the field and I remember 1 play in specific in the preseason where it made me think that he isn't that prototype player who I thought he was. Maybe I'll have to take a closer look. There is no questioning his enforcer ability and his in the box play.

From day 1 of the season, I wanted to see Clinton-Dix at free safety and Sean Richardson at strong safety. To me, they have the perfect skill sets to play those positions. I absolutely love the combination of safeties the Packers have this year. Each one brings something unique to the table and it's amazing how the weak unit on the defense one year ago now is strength of the team. Excellent front office decisions, coaching, and off season work.

****************************************************************************************************************************************************************************
Sean Richardson:

Height: 6'02"
Weight: 216
40 Yard Dash (combine): 4.52

Strengths Richardson runs extremely smooth and fast, although he doesn't get to full speed often. When he does, he could compete with the fastest in the league at his position. He has strong ball skills, and when he puts these two traits together, Richardson is an impressive safety. He has the natural ability to start in the NFL if he can shore up technical weaknesses.

Weaknesses Richardson rarely was given the opportunity to cut it loose on the back end at Vanderbilt. He has some serious issues in man coverage, as he was undisciplined in the few exposures he had in college. He struggled when put in zone coverage, as well, and has a long way to go before his alignments and all-around skill set is up to par with his athleticism.
****************************************************************************************************************************************************************************

So far this year, Sean has played 36 total snaps and PFF grades him out at +1.0 (+1.6 run defense!) with his weakness being his pass rush (-0.4) ability and to a lesser extent, pass coverage (-0.2). He has been thrown at 3 times with 1 reception for 16 yards. He has 5 tackles, 1 missed tackle with 1 stop. (Stats are from PFF)

I think if we have to go Sean this week he will be the perfect replacement for Burnett. Both are pretty solid against the run (IMO). I expect him to roam the Line of Scrimmage and give as much run support as possible while dropping into short coverage with HHCD patrolling the deeper zones.

Even if Burnett can go, I would love to see Sean get some heavy action today. I have been high on him and like what I have seen so far. I think this kid could end up being a starter for us. Amazing, not even a year ago we had the worst Safeties in the league. Enter a 21st overall pick and suddenly it is a position of strength. I think Sean can start and/or substitute without us missing a beat.

Its not whether you get knocked down, its whether you get up. -V. Lombardi

Offline skcusICH

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #40 on: October 26, 2014, 09:37:54 AM »
Beagle,

Do you think they'll play Richardson alongside Ha Ha in base and nickel? I don't think it will happen. I'd like to see it, but I just have the feeling that's not going to be the choice. I'm expecting to see Hyde as the deep safety and Ha Ha playing Burnett's role.

Offline Beagle

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #41 on: October 26, 2014, 10:17:18 AM »
Beagle,

Do you think they'll play Richardson alongside Ha Ha in base and nickel? I don't think it will happen. I'd like to see it, but I just have the feeling that's not going to be the choice. I'm expecting to see Hyde as the deep safety and Ha Ha playing Burnett's role.

If Burnett cannot play, I see Richardson just taking his place. Technically, playing run is easier for a rookie Safety than having to play deep center and make split second choices. That is why I think Richardson could be "plug and play" with Burnett out. Just my opinion. I did not keep up with how the Packers practiced this week and how they were utilizing Richardson.

I can't find anything definitive on the status of Burnett so it might be a game time decision. Even if Burnett plays, if he is gimpy, I can see them sitting him on certain plays (defensive formations) or if we get a big lead, pulling him out completely. 

I am getting more and more enthusiastic about the defense. The top echelon numbers are not there yet but they get a lot of turnovers, keep points off the board and they seem to be finding their groove. Even if we lose this game (Saints are tough on offense....but I still think we blow them out, big time) tonight it is not the end of world. I expect us to lose at least 2-3 more before the season is over and this may be one of them. But the secondary is pretty solid and our DL is coming around and I like the NASCAR package.

Capers just might be able to make something out of all of this. But I still think it will come down to our offense scoring points. In the end, if Rodgers is...well, Rodgers, we are going to destroy the Saints tonight. I cannot see any way they stop Nelson, Cobb and Adams unless we start dropping passes or Rodgers is just way off tonight. 
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Offline BobW

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #42 on: October 26, 2014, 06:03:33 PM »
Inactives:
16 QB Scott Tolzien
37 CB Sam Shields
42 S Morgan Burnett
54 LB Carl Bradford
72 C Garth Gerhart
83 WR Jeff Janis
95 DE Datone Jones

On defense, 31 CB Davon House starts for Shields, 21 S Ha Ha Clinton-Dix starts for Burnett, and 93 DE Josh Boyd starts for Jones.

Graham is active for the Saints.

Offline LMG

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #43 on: October 26, 2014, 06:13:18 PM »
Inactives:
16 QB Scott Tolzien
37 CB Sam Shields
42 S Morgan Burnett
54 LB Carl Bradford
72 C Garth Gerhart
83 WR Jeff Janis
95 DE Datone Jones

On defense, 31 CB Davon House starts for Shields, 21 S Ha Ha Clinton-Dix starts for Burnett, and 93 DE Josh Boyd starts for Jones.

Graham is active for the Saints.


Thanks for the info.


It will interesting to see how are DB's do against Bree's.


Thinking the Saints will run with Ingram alot.
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Online ricky

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Re: The OFFICIAL Packers v Saints Game Day Thread
« Reply #44 on: October 26, 2014, 06:23:19 PM »
Thanks for the info.


It will interesting to see how are DB's do against Bree's.


Thinking the Saints will run with Ingram alot.

The play of the DB's will be at least partially dependent on how much time Brees hasto throw. Even if they don't sack him, if the D line can make him throw before he wants to, that will help a lot.

Agree that the Saints are going to test the Packers run D. Why not? That had been a real problem early on, so why not see if it can be exploited?
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