September 25, 2017, 07:06:02 PM

Author Topic: Overall Roster Impressions  (Read 4298 times)

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Online cheech

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Overall Roster Impressions
« on: September 03, 2017, 09:09:12 AM »
This is, to me, one of the thinnest rosters in Ted's recent tenure.  Talent at the top with a lot of special steamers at the bottom.

OL - after our first 5 the depth takes a huge nose dive.  Ted kept 4 of the 5 2nd string OL that couldn't run or pass block vs 2nd and 3rd stringers this preseason. 

TE - Due to FA signings, this position is in very good shape.

QB - no change from last year. 

RB - seemingly solid but inexperienced.  We will see rookie mistakes this year.  Williams has been missing cut-back lanes quite often.  I also don't think we have a back that will create something out of nothing, so to speak.  Not good news considering our guards are far less mobile than 2 years ago.  The running game will take a pretty big hit this year.

WR - a lot of hype and nobody rose to the top. We have 4 good ones and then 2 special teamers.  More on the young guys later.

DL - I think our top three will be very good in both run D and pressure.  After that RJF and Ringo are replacement players.  RJF doesn't offer pass rush and Ringo will get washed out of running plays.  Both can eat snaps, but neither will positively impact the game.

OLB - Perry is our only 3 down player.  Matthews won't hold up all season at this position - already hurting his groin in limited preseason snaps.  He's better when he can be moved around. Assuming we do sign Brooks, we have another edge enforcer.  Elliott and Fackrell are ST bodies. 

ILB - I'm OK with what we have here.  Ryan is our best ILB overall.  Thomas has some really good games and then loses his guys in zone coverage.  Martinez is a replacement level player.

CB - I don't see a #1 guy.  Rollins is looking better and is suited well for the slot.  King is probably next, if he gets his hands on his guy.  After that?  House, Randall, Hawkins, and Gunter are all about even IMO.  We're in better shape than last year at least.

S - THIS is the one position of talent and depth.  The worst you can say is the fact that Jones and Brice make too many mental errors.  We have playmakers at 1 - 5.

ST - I'd like to think we have above average kicking and punting. 


In my opinion, Ted kept lesser players in Pipkins, McCray, Murphy, and Patrick.   Maybe the league in general lacks talent at these positions so he kept guys that he thought might go claimed.  The league does have an abundance of wide receivers, so it seems like his strategy here was to cut all the young guys thinking that they can't all go claimed.  I'm sure he'll re-sign 2 to 3 of these guys to the PS.

Any time we have 12 behind center this team will have a chance to win.  I see a weaker roster than many years, but if our starters remain healthy we will have a good chance to play in February.


« Last Edit: September 03, 2017, 09:37:42 AM by cheech »
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Offline Pugger

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #1 on: September 03, 2017, 10:13:31 AM »
This is, to me, one of the thinnest rosters in Ted's recent tenure.  Talent at the top with a lot of special steamers at the bottom.

OL - after our first 5 the depth takes a huge nose dive.  Ted kept 4 of the 5 2nd string OL that couldn't run or pass block vs 2nd and 3rd stringers this preseason.  I heard we are still looking for depth here.

TE - Due to FA signings, this position is in very good shape.

QB - no change from last year. 

RB - seemingly solid but inexperienced.  We will see rookie mistakes this year.  Williams has been missing cut-back lanes quite often.  I also don't think we have a back that will create something out of nothing, so to speak.  Not good news considering our guards are far less mobile than 2 years ago.  The running game will take a pretty big hit this year.  Did we really see much from our RBs this TC?  Someone on another forum mentioned Lacy looked pedestrian in his rookie preseason.  And Ty looks ripped! 

WR - a lot of hype and nobody rose to the top. We have 4 good ones and then 2 special teamers.  More on the young guys later.  There are some clubs who would love to have 4 good ones.  Don't be surprised if other teams gobble up those young guys.

DL - I think our top three will be very good in both run D and pressure.  After that RJF and Ringo are replacement players.  RJF doesn't offer pass rush and Ringo will get washed out of running plays.  Both can eat snaps, but neither will positively impact the game. I think Lowry will positively impact the game along with Daniels and Clark.

OLB - Perry is our only 3 down player.  Matthews won't hold up all season at this position - already hurting his groin in limited preseason snaps.  He's better when he can be moved around. Assuming we do sign Brooks, we have another edge enforcer.  Elliott and Fackrell are ST bodies.  We'll have to see how Brooks performs.  At least we addressed this. 

ILB - I'm OK with what we have here.  Ryan is our best ILB overall.  Thomas has some really good games and then loses his guys in zone coverage.  Martinez is a replacement level player.

CB - I don't see a #1 guy.  Rollins is looking better and is suited well for the slot.  King is probably next, if he gets his hands on his guy.  After that?  House, Randall, Hawkins, and Gunter are all about even IMO.  We're in better shape than last year at least.  I thought Randall looked better this summer and House is better than Hawkins and Gunter.

S - THIS is the one position of talent and depth.  The worst you can say is the fact that Jones and Brice make too many mental errors.  We have playmakers at 1 - 5.

ST - I'd like to think we have above average kicking and punting. 


In my opinion, Ted kept lesser players in Pipkins, McCray, Murphy, and Patrick.   Maybe the league in general lacks talent at these positions so he kept guys that he thought might go claimed.  The league does have an abundance of wide receivers, so it seems like his strategy here was to cut all the young guys thinking that they can't all go claimed.  I'm sure he'll re-sign 2 to 3 of these guys to the PS.

Any time we have 12 behind center this team will have a chance to win.  I see a weaker roster than many years, but if our starters remain healthy we will have a good chance to play in February.


 I donno, I think this roster looks better than last year's.  If we can get a decent pass rush and our CBs are better than last year this defense can be good enough.  Look how far we got last year with that disaster at corner?
« Last Edit: September 03, 2017, 10:15:16 AM by Pugger »

Offline SDProfessor

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #2 on: September 03, 2017, 10:28:51 AM »
It's almost as if TT thought that he'd make up for the lack of quality of OL with quantity.

I'm not as worried about the WR cuts because GB may actually get all of them back on the PS (well, the one's they want).

I have no problem keeping Pipkins. I thought a couple weeks ago that he was on track to make the team.

I think every position group looks pretty good. The only exception is OL. Patrick and McCray just don't look like they belong in the NFL. Of course, Spriggs is also struggling. Murphy can probably on play on the right side. And Barclay is hurt (and is not a good player).

Rough.

Online Gregg

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2017, 06:58:48 PM »
That was a really apt critique cheech.

Done without green and golds on.

I agree with about everything you said, except about our ILB.  I really wished we would have improved that spot in the offseason.


Online cheech

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #4 on: September 03, 2017, 07:12:06 PM »
That was a really apt critique cheech.

Done without green and golds on.

I agree with about everything you said, except about our ILB.  I really wished we would have improved that spot in the offseason.

Thanks. 

Honestly, I think we'll still see Matthews at ILB, so that did go into my thought process.  I do really like Ryan.

I also should have waited a few hours.  The addition of Odom and the possibility of adding Dial is quite encouraging.  Those guys could really shore up some depth concerns. 
I'm right and everyone else does not have an opinion worth talking about.

Offline Leader

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #5 on: September 03, 2017, 07:18:16 PM »
 :) Was thinking to award you Gregg - being the first person to apply the term "Green & Gold" (glasses) in 2017 - but unfortunately, the regular season hasnt actually begun yet and TC/PS doesnt count. So you can still be firstm but you'll have to  get your entry in quickly once it does!  LOL

Online Twain

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2017, 07:21:23 PM »
:) Was thinking to award you Gregg - being the first person to apply the term "Green & Gold" (glasses) in 2017 - but unfortunately, the regular season hasnt actually begun yet and TC/PS doesnt count. So you can still be firstm but you'll have to  get your entry in quickly once it does!  LOL

Oh come on!  The roster is set, so the 2017 year is on.  Give the man his award! >:D
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Online golfman

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #7 on: September 03, 2017, 07:23:25 PM »
:) Was thinking to award you Gregg - being the first person to apply the term "Green & Gold" (glasses) in 2017 - but unfortunately, the regular season hasnt actually begun yet and TC/PS doesnt count. So you can still be firstm but you'll have to  get your entry in quickly once it does!  LOL

Oh come on!  The roster is set, so the 2017 year is on.  Give the man his award! >:D

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Online iarwain

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #8 on: September 03, 2017, 11:23:26 PM »
I was expecting the team to be thin in certain positions, and it is.  There are questions with the OL and pass rush, and that's assuming that the corners make a big bounce back from last year.  Still, at this point in time, the roster looks better than I had expected it to, so I have (perhaps naively) upgraded my status to "cautiously optimistic".

Good point on the inexperience at RB.  I hope we don't get a lot of fumbles, that could really hurt.  I'm a little disappointed that none of the young guys Ted drafted seem to be standing out, but it's early yet.

Online Gregg

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2017, 02:21:43 AM »
Twain:

Is there any cash involved?

Should I write a speech?

Online OneTwoSixFive

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2017, 02:32:27 AM »
This is, to me, one of the thinnest rosters in Ted's recent tenure.  Talent at the top with a lot of special steamers at the bottom.

That is what good teams tend to have, talent at the top, STs at the bottom. Average teams are thinner at the top, bad teams have good guys at only a couple of spots.

OL - after our first 5 the depth takes a huge nose dive.  Ted kept 4 of the 5 2nd string OL that couldn't run or pass block vs 2nd and 3rd stringers this preseason. 

So the quality, from 6th guy down, isn't to your liking, what imaginary team are you dreaming of ?

WR - a lot of hype and nobody rose to the top. We have 4 good ones and then 2 special teamers.  More on the young guys later.

Again, four good ones (in your words) and still you manage to complain ? Davis may yet prove more than a ST guy.

DL - I think our top three will be very good in both run D and pressure.  After that RJF and Ringo are replacement players.  RJF doesn't offer pass rush and Ringo will get washed out of running plays.  Both can eat snaps, but neither will positively impact the game.

Yet again, a good top three, maybe 4 if Adams steps up like he looked early in camp. Three of the players are ascending (Lowry, Clark and likely Adams). Reasonable 5th and 6th string. Safety is not the only position with quality and depth

OLB - Perry is our only 3 down player.  Matthews won't hold up all season at this position - already hurting his groin in limited preseason snaps.  He's better when he can be moved around. Assuming we do sign Brooks, we have another edge enforcer.  Elliott and Fackrell are ST bodies.

Elliott is gone. Odom looks to be a new addition. Biegel is a wild card available mid-season.

ILB - I'm OK with what we have here.  Ryan is our best ILB overall.  Thomas has some really good games and then loses his guys in zone coverage.  Martinez is a replacement level player.

Too early to label Martinez a replacement level player, as it is only year 2 for him and he was dinged up his rookie year. Let him play this season before you dismiss him.
   
In my opinion, Ted kept lesser players in Pipkins, McCray, Murphy, and Patrick.   Maybe the league in general lacks talent at these positions so he kept guys that he thought might go claimed.  The league does have an abundance of wide receivers, so it seems like his strategy here was to cut all the young guys thinking that they can't all go claimed.  I'm sure he'll re-sign 2 to 3 of these guys to the PS.

Patrick makes more sense when you realise Barclay went to IR. Packers must have a backup center. Murphy looked ok to me, not a finished product, but ok. McCray looks like a placeholder for someone else, once Patrick is out of concussion protocol, he is on thin ground. WRs Yancey and Clark made it to the PS.

I find your assessment emphasising the negative and glossing over the positive. My post emphasises some of the positive.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2017, 02:37:06 AM by OneTwoSixFive »
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Online cheech

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #11 on: September 04, 2017, 07:52:41 AM »
I thought I did... when I said if we stay healthy we could be playing in February.

Every competitive team has 4 good receivers.  Many teams have a better starting group than we do.  Allison is not the best #4 in the league just because he wears G and G. 
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Offline Pugger

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #12 on: September 04, 2017, 08:02:23 AM »
I thought I did... when I said if we stay healthy we could be playing in February.

Every competitive team has 4 good receivers.  Many teams have a better starting group than we do.  Allison is not the best #4 in the league just because he wears G and G.

If our biggest weakness is depth on the O line and OLB - and Ted is still trying to bolster the pass rush - I'd say we are in pretty good shape.  There isn't a team in this league without weaknesses and/or holes. 

Online Twain

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #13 on: September 04, 2017, 08:39:13 AM »
If our biggest weakness is depth on the O line and OLB - and Ted is still trying to bolster the pass rush - I'd say we are in pretty good shape.  There isn't a team in this league without weaknesses and/or holes.

As usual, you are the voice of reason Pugger.  I am not sure we are thinner than last year overall.

With Taylor having a year of experience now, I think we are a bit stronger on the starting OL than week one last year.  We are weaker at backup center for sure but Linsley was only available for 9 games last year so there were issues at back up center last year on week one as well. At guard I am not so sure as Barclay was so bad last year they had to play Spriggs at backup guard as well.  The back up tackles are the same as well this year, each with another year of experience.

At OLB we replace Peppers with Brooks, and Jones with Odom, so yes that is a step back.

On DL, I think we are better with Clark and Lowry playing much better, and better than Pennel and the suspended Guion last year.  Francois is an experienced run defender, and Ringo is Ringo.

ILB is exactly the same.

WR isn't much different.  We had seven last year- we lost Abbrederis who was never much more than potential with injury concerns, otherwise the same guys are on the roster for week one with Allison coming back in week 2 hopefully.

At tight end we are clearly better with two real tight ends ahead of Richard Rodgers instead of one.

RB same thing- last year only Lacy, Starks, and Rip was clearly too thin- given Lacy's chronic ankle issues and Starks huge drop off.  None of our guys are proven this year, but at least if one gets hurt we have replacements that know the playbook.  Montgomery has had a modest amount of carries, but they have been quite successful, and he brings an explosiveness that Lacy never had even when healthy.

CB- we don't start the year with a same Shields quality player, but we go deeper with guys who can get plugged in and not get a huge drop off.  These guys seem all above the level of Goodson.

Safety we lose the experience of Hyde, but other guys like Brice and Evans are coming up with more experience.


We have concerns in the case of injury yes.  I just am not buying that this roster is thinner than previous years.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2017, 09:01:02 AM by Twain »
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Online B

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Re: Overall Roster Impressions
« Reply #14 on: September 04, 2017, 08:45:57 AM »

Every competitive team has 4 good receivers.  Many teams have a better starting group than we do.  Allison is not the best #4 in the league just because he wears G and G.

Advanced statistical analytics from FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS paints a very different picture...

2016 Rankings of WR's with 50 or more receptions:

#3 Jordy Nelson,
#14 D.  Adams,
#39 R. Cobb...

2016 Rankings of WR's with 49 or less receptions:

#14 G. Allison...

Everything I saw demonstrated Allison to be greatly improved from his rookie season where he ranked 14th... (in a 32 team league)

Davis also looks light years improved from his rookie season...
Janis and Davis as #5&6 receivers are way better and worthy than just being blown off as "just" special teamers...

While I thought you did a nice job on parts of your write up Cheech, I think you're under-hyping our wide receivers.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2017, 08:59:20 AM by B »
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